Page 1 of 1

Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:33 pm
by Little_Devil
What's you view on this.

Are executive wages fair, or are they too excessive.

I received a notice today as a share holder for voting on whether this chief exec should get the pay deal shown below.

Another incoming CEO, another unreasonable pay packet. This week there’s a revolt brewing over oil and gas giant BG Group, who are looking to pay incoming CEO Helge Lund up to £25 million.

Not only is this seen as high in the industry, it is in violation of the pay policy approved by BG shareholders only six months ago at their AGM. Shareholders are being asked to approve Lund's pay packet at an extraordinary meeting next week.

Our savings give us a say at that meeting: our pension funds are BG Group shareholders, and they can vote no to this excessive pay deal.

Will you tell your pension fund to vote against Lund's pay packet? Click here to email your fund.

Investment managers and Business Secretary Vince Cable have already come out and criticised this pay packet, while industry experts have labelled it "excessive and inflammatory." [1] Over the past few years, more and more shareholders have been taking a stand against high pay – and supporting calls for companies to pay fair wages instead.

At a time of austerity, when millions are struggling financially, greed at the top through high pay destroys trust and contributes to growing levels of inequality. We have the opportunity, as pension savers, to counterbalance this and use our savings as a force for good in the investment system. So let’s group together and put that to the test.

Our pension funds are big shareholders in BG Group – if enough of them vote no, then it would be enough to reject the pay packet at BG’s meeting next week.


http://action.shareaction.org/page/m/2c ... 7250/VEsH/

My view is whilst some executives work hard, they should only be paid a maximum as a percentage of the lowest paid worker of the company, and never more than three times as much as as the highest paid manual worker. Even the most extreme wage should never be more than the lifetime wages of the lowest paid worker.

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:44 pm
by hagz
to be honest I can predict just how this is going to go. I find it ludicrous how much some people get paid (and not necessarily for making improvements in anyway)

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2014 5:43 pm
by Slavechild
In a previous place of work we were all sat down once a year and shown pie charts of how the company was doing, one of them was the payroll chart showing a huge 75% (roughly £250k+) going to the owner who wasn't there most the time while we all slaved away doing the actual work.

TL;DR: Yes they are excessively over paid.

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2014 6:08 pm
by Silkie
Very few actually work any where near hard enough or make any real difference to justify their money. Now some people do and I don't begrudge them the big money even though on a personal level I don't like some of them they do generate a lot of revenue through ideas, leadership or promoting their companies. I loathed Steve Jobs but can't deny how important his part was in selling the Apple brand. Far too many of them are just bloated ticks who suck money instead of blood and ultimately leaving their chair empty would do less damage to the companies involved.

On a personal level I've seen sales directors who deserve the big bonuses because they really could sell well and were great representatives for their company. Financial directors who kept the cash flowing in and the business a lean efficient organisation without penny pinching. Directors who understood their business and made great personal sacrifice to make it grow and prosper. Bank managers who promoted small businesses and helped guide them to become big successful companies with well deserved rewards. I've also seen people who give not one toss about doing anything but lining their pockets and sod the consequences replace all of these people over time and it hasn't been a pleasant sight.

My uncle was a well liked and very well regarded area manager for a major bank who loved to see the growth that he could help as tiny little partnerships grew into big PLC. with thousands of workers. We were very surprised when he opted for early retirement but he said that he was tired of fighting against a wave of greedy and short sighted idiots who would sadly forever damage the financial sector. I think he seems to have been proved right.

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2014 10:03 pm
by Security
This is going to be very one sided as the only people who find that they earn that money are the ones getting it, everybody else seems to disagree.

As for me, I feel that none is that good or irreplaceable that the amount of money paid is justified.
Of course if someone build up a company I feel that it is fair that they get a big chunk of the profits, they did the work to get the company in that position and should be allowed to reap the benefits. But I feel that the people working there should also get there share of the profits (maybe even depend the amount on how long someone worked at the company and how valuable they are too the company).

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 3:34 am
by Shuriken
Management pay should be based on a percentage of the employees pay which should be based on company performance. I honestly thought this was how it worked when I was a kid, so much faith in humanity lost over the years.

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 9:46 am
by Enigma
If the company is making profit then why not. If you think that exec just sits there all day and does nothing you're an idiot. It takes quite a lot of effort to run a company no matter how big.

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 4:39 pm
by ListerofSMEG-2
Steve Jobs' salary when he was at Apple for a second time was just $1 a year.

He also had a good portion of stock in the company too though.

He was already a multi millionaire thanks to his ownership of Pixar Animation studios & previous exploits

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 8:14 pm
by Security
People like Jobs and Gates are special cases even in the overpaid exec world so discussing them is pretty useless in this threads context. :P

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:06 pm
by Slavechild
True, doesn't Gates give a huge huge huge sum of money to charity every year along with a lot of other stuff?

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2014 2:44 am
by Little_Devil
Enigma wrote:If the company is making profit then why not. If you think that exec just sits there all day and does nothing you're an idiot. It takes quite a lot of effort to run a company no matter how big.


Money has to come from somewhere and to be able to pay someone huge amounts of money it has to go from the poorest in society up to the richest.

Simple enough to work out really then extrapolate from that point forwards.
Start with any amount of money you like in the whole of society. It can be 1 Million Euro or 1 Trillion Euro, it makes no difference other than how you divide it down, it is always going to be a finite sum, with ofc your interest added on top which is why you will always have inflation.

So as you pay these ingrates ever more money, the money has to shift away from the poorest in society, then those in the middle on up to the top of the fiscal ladder. Why do you think certain groups try to undermine countries with different values to theirs. Commercialism just makes the poor poorer and the rich richer.

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2014 1:23 pm
by Security
Slavechild wrote:True, doesn't Gates give a huge huge huge sum of money to charity every year along with a lot of other stuff?

Yeah I heard he has given away roughly half his fortune to charity and is planning on giving it all away.

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 6:47 pm
by alias
Slavechild wrote:In a previous place of work we were all sat down once a year and shown pie charts of how the company was doing, one of them was the payroll chart showing a huge 75% (roughly £250k+) going to the owner who wasn't there most the time while we all slaved away doing the actual work.

I bet its the person saying he works worth 80h a week sitting only worth 10h at a desk and 70h at a relaxing resort answering phonecalls that dont matter but still fall under HRM and making promises that only frustrate his own employees)...

And as programmer you only sit for 40h a week at your desk spending the remaining 128h thinking about solving the problem in your programming because he made a promise that didnt make sense.

Like this:



Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 7:10 pm
by Security
Wow that is frustrating but recognisable to watch.

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:07 pm
by Little_Devil
I have no objection to owners who start companies drawing large wages at a later date, as the amount of unpaid hours you put in its earlier years is quite extreme. Particularly when you pay staff the going market rate for wages, whilst you scrimp and save every little bit you can, working extraordinary length hours with less wages than most companies pay a cleaner.

I have a friend who used to have hardly any furniture in his flat, and work silly hours whilst being the lowest paid worker for many years, just so he could get the business established with key staff paying the market rate for those workers. He has now reaped the benefit of those hard years, with a house costing over a £Million in this country and another house on the French Riviera. He still does not take large wages, opting to let his companies profitability pay his expenses by way of share dividends.

The objection I have to huge wages, is the fact to pay those wages the money has to come from somewhere and it is usually out of the pockets of the poorest in society.

Re: Excessive Pay for Execs

PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 4:57 pm
by Little_Devil
Just to punctuate this, I just received this from Share Action

Britain’s biggest retailers are putting up their festive adverts and filling their windows with scenes of a winter wonderland. It’s starting to feel a little bit like Christmas… but something is missing.

While these retailers spend millions to make it look like Christmas, they’re not sharing the Christmas spirit with their staff. The 12 biggest UK retailers, including the likes of Sainsbury’s, Tesco and Sports Direct, don’t pay a Living Wage. Some of them may also use insecure 'zero hours' contracts. This means that their hard working staff - from cleaners to cashiers - aren’t earning enough to adequately feed their families and heat their homes this holiday season.


Have a look here for 12 retailers, and click on each link to see their Profits before tax (they would pay less tax if they paid a living wage, plus get tax free incentives to do so)

Example : Although the chief execa pay is not excessive imo
Sport Direct.com
Although the chief execa pay is not excessive imo
Profit before tax: £239.5m

Chief Executive Dave Forsey’s 2013 pay package: £150,000

Why haven’t they stepped up yet?

Sports Direct scored an own goal on the way it treated its workers, particularly getting into the limelight for its excessive use of zero-hours contracts. We asked the board at the AGM about both this bad practice and the Living Wage. Our questions were answered bluntly by their Founder and Executive Deputy Chairman, Mike Ashley who said that they could make no comment about their staff because of a lawsuit.


however the pay of John Lewis is particularly when you look at their employment track record.

Profit before partnership bonus and tax: £329m

As John Lewis has no CEO, their Chairman Sir Charlie Mayfield’s pay package for 2013 was: £1,520,000

Why haven’t they stepped up yet?

We asked John Lewis for their position on the Living Wage, including for staff who are employed through contractors in their UK stores, like cleaners. They told us that:

Fair pay is one of the core principles of the John Lewis Partnership and we share the Living Wage campaign’s objectives to pay employees fairly. We achieve that, however, through different means. Our policy is to pay the market rate for a job and as much above that as can be justified by performance. On top of that, our Partners receive a share of our profits as well as other benefits such as a final salary pension (after a qualifying period).”

We appreciate their sentiments, but wonder about the Living Wage for cleaners who don’t receive the benefits of being Partners since they’re hired through third-party contractors. John Lewis was in dialogue with Citizens UK on the Living Wage. We’d like to see the Living Wage achieved for everyone who works at John Lewis shops!


http://www.livingwage.org.uk/?&utm_medi ... =LWscrooge