Weed

This forum is for posting meaningful and serious ideas and questions. Can be about interests, observations or serious matters of the world. If it doesn't fit that category, don't post here! Serious posts only.

Re: Weed

Postby Haze on Fri Jul 17, 2009 2:59 pm

you can type this phrase

"why is marijuana illegal"

into google and do some research, you definately need to do this more often.


User avatar
Haze
Old Timer
 
Player: Haze
STEAM_0:0:781187
 
Posts: 4367
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2006 4:23 am
Location: London

Re: Weed

Postby Wizav on Fri Jul 17, 2009 3:58 pm

Theres no single reason why its illegal and in almost everything i found the mental effects of the drug are one of the reasons. Reefer madness was the term used. Other reasons were paper production , racism , taxing and several other reasons.

haze you seem to think its illegal for a single reason. You need to do some research aswell to be honest.


Wizav
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: Wizav
STEAM_1:3:666666
 
Posts: 2222
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 12:51 pm

Re: Weed

Postby Haze on Fri Jul 17, 2009 5:00 pm

well its not this reason as we haven't had any clear knowledge of its side effects until the last 5 years or so.

The only reason i think its illegal is because of the negative mental effects.


you can read this page, which is the first one to come up on google when you search, i wouldn't take it as gospel but its food for thought.http://blogs.salon.com/0002762/stories/2003/12/22/whyIsMarijuanaIllegal.html


User avatar
Haze
Old Timer
 
Player: Haze
STEAM_0:0:781187
 
Posts: 4367
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2006 4:23 am
Location: London

Re: Weed

Postby Zeemlapje on Fri Jul 17, 2009 9:30 pm

fixxxer wrote:Well according to new research published this year, smoking cannabis alone can be linked to cancer, and in particular the most aggressive form of testicular cancer, nonseminoma.
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/138372.php
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/154224.php

Read their method of diagnosing. I also want to see how big the chances are to get to testicular cancer because of those other factors.

Also

Using a newly developed highly sensitive liquid chromatography-tandem mass spectrometry method, the University of Leicester scientists found clear indication that cannabis smoke damages DNA, under laboratory conditions.


What?

under laboratory conditions


Oh, there we go.

fixxxer wrote:Unfortunately that's not really a convincing argument. Not all decisions are calculated and premeditated. I'm pretty sure that those who have suffered psychological trauma never planned to experience that side effect. The bottom line is, as far as legalisation goes, this is pretty much the strongest argument against its legalisation, besides the link to cancer.

Smoking weed for the first time is like driving on your own car for the first time, it could end out well or you could trash your car and die. Should we outlaw cars because they kill people? No! Because you're making the choise to drive that car. Same thing with weed, you're given the choise to smoke and you take it or not.

fixxxer wrote:I think the government loses too much money to nicotine addicts and the health care they receive on the NHS, which is why they want to get rid of it. Ideally dealers would make money doing something legitimate, and I don't think many dealers can actually make money from selling weed, and there are much more profitable drugs as readily available as cannabis. Legalising weed would not change that relationship, the drug dealers would still deal drugs, and the drug users would still buy drugs, legal or otherwise.

Not every country has the same healthcare system. And we're not talking about the dealers making money out of this, we're talking about a whole underground system of growers, house owners, transporters, clippers and the list goes on. And guess what? All these people earn more money than your average Joe just by watering/dealing/trimming some plants. Once Cannabis is legalised there will be new jobs, people can and most likely will grow their own Cannabis which means no more illegal market, less people who want to smoke weed will be confronted with dealers that offer harder drugs such as crack, meth, heroin and so on.

Wizav wrote:If it was legal half the population would be couch potatoes and to lazy/stoned to do anything.

Weed is decriminalized and available for purchase to anyone who is 18 years or older in The Netherlands, and IDs are checked. So how come our society is still alive and not dying? Just because you turn into some paranoid junky after smoking weed doesn't mean others do. I smoke a nice sativa strain before delivering the newspapers because I can and I haven't had any complaints.

Last edited by Zeemlapje on Fri Jul 17, 2009 10:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Zeemlapje
Experienced Member
 
Player: 026 Райдер
STEAM_0:0:3548359
 
Posts: 1305
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 2:28 pm
Location: The Netherlands



Image

Re: Weed

Postby bokkie on Fri Jul 17, 2009 10:04 pm

yes but you have to remember the laws are much different here in the uk
Image
User avatar
bokkie
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: Mandela
STEAM_0:0:8956512
 
Posts: 2688
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:12 pm
Location: Eastbourne, East Sussex

Re: Weed

Postby Wizav on Fri Jul 17, 2009 10:39 pm

Weed is decriminalized and available for purchase to anyone who is 18 years or older in The Netherlands, and IDs are checked. So how come our society is still alive and not dying? Just because you turn into some paranoid junky after smoking weed doesn't mean others do. I smoke a nice sativa strain before delivering the newspapers because I can and I haven't had any complaints.


Thats just down to pots unpopularity in netherlands drug reports show that only 6% of teens try marajuana in the netherlands and obviously not all continue smoking. netherlands surprisingly enough dosent have many weed smokers.

6% is very low. If it was legal in Canada,US,UK that percentage would be more like 30% or even higher.


Wizav
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: Wizav
STEAM_1:3:666666
 
Posts: 2222
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 12:51 pm

Re: Weed

Postby Zeemlapje on Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:13 am

Wizav wrote:Thats just down to pots unpopularity in netherlands drug reports show that only 6% of teens try marajuana in the netherlands and obviously not all continue smoking. netherlands surprisingly enough dosent have many weed smokers.

6% is very low. If it was legal in Canada,US,UK that percentage would be more like 30% or even higher.

And you really believe only 6% of my country's teenagers has tried cannabis? Take it from me, I just graduated high school and pretty much 4 out of 5 classmates has tried it once. Hell, I even smoked with half of my classmates after the final exam during a lounge BBQ party. When looking at friends and their friends who are the same age same numbers apply.


Zeemlapje
Experienced Member
 
Player: 026 Райдер
STEAM_0:0:3548359
 
Posts: 1305
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 2:28 pm
Location: The Netherlands



Image

Re: Weed

Postby Xhiea on Mon Jul 20, 2009 1:59 pm

i've never seen somebody defend weed so much lol.

i've heard that the only reason it's illegal in the UK was because queen victoria thought it would be a threat to the tobacco market.
Image

Need help with signature text?

>>watch my video tutorial for help!<<
User avatar
Xhiea
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: Xhiea is crap at css
STEAM_0:0:5403780
 
Posts: 8957
Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2004 4:48 pm
Location: York, North Yorkshire



Image

Re: Weed

Postby fixxxer on Tue Jul 21, 2009 12:23 pm

Zeemlapje wrote:
Using a newly developed highly sensitive liquid chromatography-tandem mass spectrometry method, the University of Leicester scientists found clear indication that cannabis smoke damages DNA, under laboratory conditions.


What?

under laboratory conditions


Oh, there we go.

And in the paragraph before that one:
There have been many studies on the toxicity of tobacco smoke. It is known that tobacco smoke contains 4000 chemicals of which 60 are classed as carcinogens.

The term carcinogen refers to any substance, radionuclide or radiation that is an agent directly involved in the promotion of cancer or in the increase of its propagation. So what does this have to do with Cannabis?

Cannabis in contrast has not been so well studied. It is less combustible than tobacco and is often mixed with tobacco in use. Cannabis smoke contains 400 compounds including 60 cannabinoids. However, because of its lower combustibility it contains 50% more carcinogenic polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons including naphthalene, benzanthracene, and benzopyrene, than tobacco smoke.

So basically, the effects observed in the laboratory are pointing to the fact that smoking Cannabis is at least as toxic, if not more toxic than smoking Tobacco.


User avatar
fixxxer
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: ChrisG
STEAM_0:0:5048751
 
Posts: 192
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:18 am
Location: Sheffield

Re: Weed

Postby Zircon on Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:18 pm

fixxxer wrote:So basically, the effects observed in the laboratory are pointing to the fact that smoking Cannabis is at least as toxic, if not more toxic than smoking Tobacco.

Ok, this is just a thought but... does the amount matter? I know people who can smoke a pack of cigarettes (~20 grams) in one day but I think no one would smoke that kind of amount of cannabis in one day.

So cannabis is more dangerous than tobacco? Let's ask...
World Health Organisation?
or European Union? oh well, you'd have to read the report, which costs 20€, to know the details... It was in Finnish news though http://www.mtv3.fi/uutiset/arkisto.shtm ... /07/669288
So, we should keep it illegal, eh? Let's ask...
United Nations?

Life is too short to be unhappy. I'd rather waste it than do nothing with it at all. Is that someone's loss?
From my experience and knowledge I can say that for me cannabis is right used a fairly safe and mild drug which I enjoy more than alcohol. It is sad that the common public opinion is that all the cannabis users are junkies or criminals (well technically they are criminals :P). I wait for the times when freedom exists. Until that, may the arguments fly like lightnings!
Image
User avatar
Zircon
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: Duane
STEAM_0:0:9874604
 
Posts: 1741
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:18 am
Location: Finland

Re: Weed

Postby Flawless on Thu Jul 23, 2009 2:36 am

Only reason tabaco hasn't been made illeagl is the amount of money it brings in for goverments all across the world and that it has been around for so long and could you imagine it if it was made illegal for anywhere to sell? Don't kid yourself that its less dangerous than cannibus just because it isn't illegal. Same goes for alcohol, there would be over night riots in this day and age if the goverment was foolish enough to ban it.

Perhaps Doctors should have rode cannbias harder for being good for you like they did with cigarettes. `
Image
F is for Flawesome
User avatar
Flawless
UKCS Life Sponsor
Moderator
 
Player: FLawless
STEAM_0:1:6217222
 
Posts: 9604
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2006 2:24 pm
Location: Norn Iron



Image

Re: Weed

Postby Bob the Crab on Sat Jul 25, 2009 12:56 am

Wizav wrote:If it was legal half the population would be couch potatoes and to lazy/stoned to do anything.

Yes and because alcohol is legal everyone is drunk 24/7.


Bob the Crab
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: BRUDDHA
000000000000
 
Posts: 1240
Joined: Sun Mar 11, 2007 12:38 pm

Re: Weed

Postby Wizav on Sat Jul 25, 2009 10:49 am

Yes and because alcohol is legal everyone is drunk 24/7.


Think about it... Drinking 24/7 kills you. It fucks up your organs not to mention cost. Thats tottaly different from having 1-2 spliffs a day which would cost £30-£50 per week depending on location and quality of weed. And it dosent give you liver failure or destroy your stomach.

Its also much harder to shadow the fact that your drunk especially at work and during the day. Its quite easy to be stoned and appear normal though.


Wizav
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: Wizav
STEAM_1:3:666666
 
Posts: 2222
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 12:51 pm

Re: Weed

Postby Haze on Sun Jul 26, 2009 11:35 am

I fail to see how alcohol is a good yard stick for smoking cannabis.

i


User avatar
Haze
Old Timer
 
Player: Haze
STEAM_0:0:781187
 
Posts: 4367
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2006 4:23 am
Location: London

Re: Weed

Postby Wizav on Sun Jul 26, 2009 12:39 pm

Its not im just saying its impossible to drink alcohol 24/7 without dieing after so many weeks/months.

Can quite easily smoke cannabis daily for many years though like you can tobbaco.


Wizav
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: Wizav
STEAM_1:3:666666
 
Posts: 2222
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 12:51 pm

Re: Weed

Postby Unspecified on Sun Jul 26, 2009 1:02 pm

It all comes down to how much you drink or smoke. You can drink enough alcohol daily to kill yourself, and smoke enough to do the same eventually.

I think the point is that just as most people are able to moderate their drinking and drink regularly without drinking too much, theres no reason why you cant smoke cannabis in moderation...
ImageUKCS Head Moderator. Retired Senior TF2 Admin.
Feel free to send me a Image or message me through Image with any questions or problems.
Don't forget that UKCS has an image uploader that's fast and free for all members!


17:43 - Salva: i did find out im not pregnant
User avatar
Unspecified
Executive Admin
Head Moderator
UKCS iSeries Attendee
 
Player: unspecified
STEAM_0:0:2326270
 
Posts: 4923
Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2008 3:05 pm
Location: UK



Image

Re: Weed

Postby Wizav on Sun Jul 26, 2009 3:27 pm

Well canabis can be addictive. Read this article. Especially the last paragraph. Alcohol simply dosent cause those statistics when it comes to mental health. Cannabis is obviously effecting alot of peoples mental health.

According to the Observer, drug treatment centres are reporting a rise in the number of cannabis cases they are dealing with. Nine per cent of all those attending clinics cited cannabis as the main reason for seeking treatment, twice as many as a decade ago.

Michael Rowlands, medical director at the Priory Farm Place, says cannabis shows all the classic signs of dependency.

"There's a strong desire to use, which overrides other activities, so friends and hobbies and work are neglected," he says. "There's difficulty in controlling the amounts you use. There's a degree of tolerance developed so you need higher doses to have the same effect. And then you persist in using despite the fact it's causing you ill health or debt."

The main thing that separates cannabis from heroin or nicotine is that the physical withdrawal state is not normally as severe.

Almost all addictive drugs stimulate a part of the brain - called the mesolymbic dopamine system - that acts as a reward pathway in the central nervous system. Receptors for the active ingredients in cannabis have been found in this system. Once stimulated, these receptors begin a cycle of reward that can lead people to use more of the drug.

Rowlands says the apparent increase in cases of addiction might be nothing more than a product of the changing attitudes towards cannabis use. "Some of the stigma is going. People are much easier at talking about addiction," he says. "There are vast numbers of people taking cannabis. Some of them, 8 to10%, will get some type of dependency."

More concerning than any apparent rise in addiction is the potential to cause psychoses in heavy users.

Robin Murray, a psychiatrist at King's College London, is one of Britain's leading researchers in this area and his results are worrying. "The conclusion was that, if you took cannabis at age 18, you were about 60% more likely to go psychotic. But if you started by the time you were 15, then the risk was much greater, around 450%," he says.


Wizav
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: Wizav
STEAM_1:3:666666
 
Posts: 2222
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 12:51 pm

Re: Weed

Postby Zircon on Sun Jul 26, 2009 4:57 pm

Did you watch this document Wizav?
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 4651731007
It has a good bit about the "cannabis addiction"...
Teenagers shouldn't use it in my opinion. There should be laws but not prohibition laws.
Image
User avatar
Zircon
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: Duane
STEAM_0:0:9874604
 
Posts: 1741
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:18 am
Location: Finland

Re: Weed

Postby Wizav on Sun Jul 26, 2009 5:57 pm

That video is almost 2 hours long. Id prefer to watch a movie.

And i dont need to watch it neways. I know over 100 people in my town that smoked it , I smoked it myself and we were all at some point addicted. Thats all i need to know about cannabis and addiction.


Wizav
UKCS Sponsor
 
Player: Wizav
STEAM_1:3:666666
 
Posts: 2222
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 12:51 pm

Re: Weed

Postby Aceo on Sun Jul 26, 2009 9:35 pm

Wizav wrote: "The conclusion was that, if you took cannabis at age 18, you were about 60% more likely to go psychotic. But if you started by the time you were 15, then the risk was much greater, around 450%," he says.


What's the actual statistics for this? 60% more than what? 450% more than what? They need to clarify this and preferably give some absolute chances rather than relative.

Also, the first paragraph, where it says people attending are citing that as the main reason for treatment, does not mean that it IS the real reason.

There's a degree of tolerance developed so you need higher doses to have the same effect. And then you persist in using despite the fact it's causing you ill health or debt."


Just like alcohol, and the addiction to it. Remember when you first started drinking? Compare how much you could drink then to how much you can now.
Tolerance is developed, need higher doses and is still done despite the fact it's causing you ill health etc...


Aceo
UKCS Sponsor
UKCS iSeries Attendee
 
Player: Aceo
STEAM_0:1:8775008
 
Posts: 716
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 4:16 pm
Location: England, Hull



Image

PreviousNext

Return to Thinkers Topics

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: CommonCrawl [Bot] and 0 guests