North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby The Knife on Wed Mar 06, 2013 9:23 pm

Dauntless wrote:
The Knife wrote: You need medical help dude, because you're clearly delusional. Russia, Pakistan and China allies of DPRK? Like really?


Quite alot of these countries have unofficial ties with NK and whilst not openly calling themselves allies, they have not turned their backs on them either. China aided NK before the cease fire by sending 500,000+ troops for the war, it was China that was on NK side during the armistice discussions. The have allies, they are just not as open as the UN.
I know the circumstances.
If there would be a war, China would never risk helping Korea against NATO/USA. Certainly not when their economy is dependent on export to Western countries.
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Security on Wed Mar 06, 2013 9:35 pm

I wouldn't be so sure of that, anything could happen if you ask me especially since the Western countries only really exploit China for the cheap labour. I think an important question would be how many Arabic countries would respond, especially Syria and the OPEC countries. We barely produce anything ourself anymore in the West so we need Asia, and we are dependent on mainly Arabic countries for oil, they would be able to hurt the West pretty badly if they want.

I suspect more countries then you suspect have pretty much had it with the attitude of the USA and there allies (hell, I even suspect many of the actual population in the Western countries have had it with the controlling attitude of the USA). None of them would stand up alone against them but when a country like China or Russia gets involved many will most likely have the courage to stand up for themselves.

When push comes to shove I wouldn't even be so sure which (if any) side the countries of South America would choose, they already do not like the USA either and are pretty independent Economy wise...
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Binerexis on Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:36 am

To be fair, it's not as if China doesn't utilize the cheap labour in the country as well; especially on things which they can tax such as money earned in the country and stays there (e.g. Chinese gold farming in games for companies that operate from China) or from taxable exports. If China wanted to shut down the cheap labour exploitation for everyone EXCEPT China, they could. But I digress.

If push comes to shove, I don't think China will side with NK on something like this. They have WAY too much to lose and the leadership of NK just isn't stable enough. They're in a difficult position, really. If they stay official allies with NK, they get bad press for being allied with them and there'll be one hell of a mess when the shit hits the fan. If they publicly denounce NK and cease being allied with them, NK no longer has a superpower to hide behind, starts to panic and then adds China to the shitlist for being back-stabbing, America supporting, treaty destroying douchebags who are a much easier target to hit with a missile (once they get working).
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Wizav on Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:49 am

China only consumes about 50% of the Oil USA do currently and economy is about half the size too but it's growing very fast and it's consumption of oil and economy will overtake USA by 2020, without Iran that's pretty much impossible and China will never be able to become a Super power. I think they'll defend Iran at all costs and they need North Korea to do that as it's North Korea that supplies Iran with all it's Chinese weapons/technology.

Americans have wanted to invade Iran for quite awhile now and China doesn't have the military strength to do anything about it without NK, Iran and Russia. Russia and NK benefit from China overtaking USA and they don't want USA to secure more oil and become even stronger so they'll support China/Iran.

The scary thing is, in ~2020 when China does overtake USA and can build and maintain a military that's equal or stronger than USA, who's going to keep NK and Iran inline because we won't be able to bully or threaten them anymore, China's going to need Iran's oil well into 2040 and it can start offering serious support and even help Iran with it's nuclear program if they wanted too.

North Korea is the only buffer between South Korea and China, In a War it's a vital choke point and only thing stopping USA/Japan landing armies in SK and driving straight into China. Russia , Iran , Pakistan and Burma cover all the other land routes into China.


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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Binerexis on Thu Mar 07, 2013 2:43 pm

To imply that China isn't already a superpower seems a little odd especially when they have a huge military force. In fact, even when you factor in reserve forces, China still has a larger military force than the US.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... _personnel
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Security on Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:51 pm

Numbers don't mean much when you factor in equipment and training. I don't know how China compares to the US tho in those regards.
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby The Knife on Thu Mar 07, 2013 6:32 pm

Security wrote:Numbers don't mean much when you factor in equipment and training. I don't know how China compares to the US tho in those regards.
At least someone with a brain. China compares badly with USA since 'Muricans are in war every decade. Whether it was Korea (50s), Vietnam (60s-70s), Gulf War (90s), Afghanistan or Iraq.
Maybe we will get a new episodes of M*A*S*H if there will be another war in Korea.
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Wizav on Thu Mar 07, 2013 8:04 pm

Binerexis wrote:To imply that China isn't already a superpower seems a little odd especially when they have a huge military force. In fact, even when you factor in reserve forces, China still has a larger military force than the US.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... _personnel


Check out military budgets

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In 2020 China's economy will be larger than USA's and that graph will start looking very different. USA is the only superpower right now in terms of economy and military. They are stronger than the next 4 countries combined.


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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Security on Thu Mar 07, 2013 8:38 pm

Do you have a source with that graph?
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Wizav on Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:08 pm

Can check expenditure here

http://milexdata.sipri.org/


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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Aceo on Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:39 pm

How much does military power correlate with military spending? Just by spending more does not mean they are more powerful than the next four combined.


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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Wizav on Fri Mar 08, 2013 12:59 am

How much does military power correlate with military spending? Just by spending more does not mean they are more powerful than the next four combined.


They have 10 nuclear powered Nimitz class carriers vs Europe and Russia's 3 smaller outdated carriers and China's single carrier that was recently built. They have double or more of everything with better technology attached to it. The only thing they don't have more of is man power.

They have 6000+ Attack helicopters, the other 4 combined have about 500


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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby The Knife on Fri Mar 08, 2013 2:41 am

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-21709917

I'm expecting a nuclear strike made by FedEx delivery as NK doesn't have any rockets able to carry nuclear warheads. They could also use pigeons to carry their warheads or dolphins. USA better be ready for that shitstorm.
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Binerexis on Fri Mar 08, 2013 3:10 am

The Knife wrote: China compares badly with USA since 'Muricans are in war every decade.


What war were the Americans involved in during the 80's?
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Security on Fri Mar 08, 2013 7:19 am

Cold war? :P
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Dauntless on Fri Mar 08, 2013 7:41 am

Wizav wrote:
How much does military power correlate with military spending? Just by spending more does not mean they are more powerful than the next four combined.


They have 10 nuclear powered Nimitz class carriers vs Europe and Russia's 3 smaller outdated carriers and China's single carrier that was recently built. They have double or more of everything with better technology attached to it. The only thing they don't have more of is man power.

They have 6000+ Attack helicopters, the other 4 combined have about 500


Trying to not be biased but despite troop numbers and spendature, the UK still have some of the best trained armed forces in the world.
I am only basing this on my own personal experience which as a reserve soldier in the TA, we trained with the US reservers in the states and over here during a 1 month exercise and they where shocked at how much training went into the reserves in the UK and not to mention we spent more than double the time training that they did.

I can't comment on the machanical side of things because I just don't know the figures. All i know is the sister company to the one I work in is getting 100's of millions of dollars to produce black hawk helicopters non stop at the moment.
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Templar+ on Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:00 am

Binerexis wrote:
The Knife wrote: China compares badly with USA since 'Muricans are in war every decade.


What war were the Americans involved in during the 80's?


Think they had a spat with Lybia during the 80's i wouldn't call it a war though.
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Templar+ on Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:06 am

Dauntless wrote:
Wizav wrote:
How much does military power correlate with military spending? Just by spending more does not mean they are more powerful than the next four combined.


They have 10 nuclear powered Nimitz class carriers vs Europe and Russia's 3 smaller outdated carriers and China's single carrier that was recently built. They have double or more of everything with better technology attached to it. The only thing they don't have more of is man power.

They have 6000+ Attack helicopters, the other 4 combined have about 500


Trying to not be biased but despite troop numbers and spendature, the UK still have some of the best trained armed forces in the world.
I am only basing this on my own personal experience which as a reserve soldier in the TA, we trained with the US reservers in the states and over here during a 1 month exercise and they where shocked at how much training went into the reserves in the UK and not to mention we spent more than double the time training that they did.

I can't comment on the machanical side of things because I just don't know the figures. All i know is the sister company to the one I work in is getting 100's of millions of dollars to produce black hawk helicopters non stop at the moment.


I have to agree with this man i had a spell of 2 years serving in the TA with the Royal Mercian & Lancastrian Yeomanry (RAC) and we spent alot of time training with the regs, I originally wanted to join the British Army but was rejected due to having a heart murmur :roll: So therefore spent some time in the TA and enjoying it immensely.

My grandfather fought in both the Korean war and the Falklands and his father fought during WW1 and WW2 with my uncle spending some time in the British Army and i wanted to carry on the tradition, sadly this was not possible.
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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Wizav on Fri Mar 08, 2013 2:40 pm

Trying to not be biased but despite troop numbers and spendature, the UK still have some of the best trained armed forces in the world.
I am only basing this on my own personal experience which as a reserve soldier in the TA, we trained with the US reservers in the states and over here during a 1 month exercise and they where shocked at how much training went into the reserves in the UK and not to mention we spent more than double the time training that they did.

I can't comment on the machanical side of things because I just don't know the figures. All i know is the sister company to the one I work in is getting 100's of millions of dollars to produce black hawk helicopters non stop at the moment.


I'd say that's more down to US not having any immediate need for there reserves while we only have 200,000 active troops and 200,000 reserves.

If we got into a War with a single country, our reserves would be required almost immediately where as America could quite easily defeat any single country with about half it's active force. The reserves would only be required in a major conflict or world war and due to active numbers, Naval and Air superiority would have plenty of time to train and equip before being needed.


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Re: North Korea plans to terminate ceasefire with the US

Postby Phoenicia on Fri Mar 08, 2013 3:21 pm

doubt anything serious would happen.
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