PC Resetting - possibly GPU

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PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Silkie on Fri Dec 06, 2013 10:02 pm

I've had a problem for a while now which has killed my gaming and I suspect it may be due to the computers graphics card but I'd like some other opinions.

After a while in a variety of games only and sometimes quite at random it hard resets with no useful error message.

The RAM tests OK and the CPU isn't running hot but the graphics card seems to be getting way hotter than it should be.

It's an MSI frozr II with no overclock and has been recently checked for dust etc. but still idles at 50 degrees C with the fan at around 50%. Now for a card like that doing nothing but running Windows 7 desktop applications that seems way too hot. The cooler on it is actually designed for overclocking and after it's done a reset it checks in at 75 degrees or more.

My main suspicion is related to an odd noise I hear that makes me wonder if the card may have a faulty bearing on one or more of the fans. Next step is of course run it with the case open and try and get an idea if the fans are indeed faulty. Luckily if this is the case it still should be covered by a warranty and the machine has an onboard VGA good enough for everything but gaming while I try and get a replacement/repair.

So do you think I may be on the right track?
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Security on Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:10 pm

GPU's are designed to be allowed to get hotter then pretty much anything (most can stand up to 100 to 120 degrees C) in your PC and the 50 degrees C doesn't sound odd at all.
You could use GPU-Z to log the data (including temp) to see what actually happens to your GPU.
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Little_Devil on Mon Dec 09, 2013 10:03 am

After a while in a variety of games only and sometimes quite at random it hard resets with no useful error message.


What Resets ?

As far as the temperature is concerned, mine is currently running at 57 deg, although that is just after a 3D app has been running.

Any noises are more than likely attributable to fans, and in a lot of cases, a good clean out is all that is required.
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Silkie on Tue Dec 10, 2013 4:06 pm

They are currently clean but this is just idling. The whole system hard resets with no error message beyond it picking up that its recovered from one.

I need to get it on the bench with the sides off and take a good look at it as well as quickly pull the cables on the PSU so I can run it on my tester to quickly eliminate that. It really is awkward that it started doing this when I've had to catch up on some house repairs as well. Much as I love gaming I have to make sure the house my PC lives in doesn't fall down around it so it's been carpentry/plumbing/electrical fixing first. I wish Santa would bring me a new one TBH but I guess I shouldn't push my luck as I forgot to leave out the snacks & booze last year.
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Little_Devil on Tue Dec 10, 2013 5:11 pm

Both XP and Win 7 has had this problem in the past, where the O.S. shuts the computer down and restarts by itself. This has had many reasons why it does this, from a registry corruption, to a hidden update ,that does not install properly.

Easiest diagnosis is to run a linux start from CD or Memory stick, and check the hardware out, although invariably you will find it is more than likely an O.S. software problem.

I always have a linux boot repair CD in my SW tools. This one is supposed to be good, although I made my own up. Hirens Boot CD http://www.hiren.info/pages/bootcd

Others :
http://www.sysresccd.org/SystemRescueCd_Homepage
http://trinityhome.org/Home/index.php?c ... T_DOWNLOAD
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Slavechild on Tue Dec 10, 2013 10:21 pm

What tower case do you use?
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Silkie on Fri Dec 27, 2013 3:16 pm

It's a Shuttle PC. Originally I didn't intend it to have such a graphics card in it but oddly the less powerful ones were physically larger than the MSI due to it's high spec cooler. I've had to leave it due to a combination of Christmas, family drama and weight loss which is causing people to flirt with me. Some games are more fun than others and don't actually need DirectX installed to work. :wink:
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Gh0st.IRE on Sun Jan 05, 2014 7:44 pm

I think my brother is having this exact same issue. Once a day, mid-game, his PC just shuts off. Completely black. No errors or nothing. It then reboots and everything is fine. (POSTs and loads up as normal - no unexpected shutdown message or anything)
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Slavechild on Sun Jan 05, 2014 8:56 pm

What's the event log saying? Also congrats on the flirting :p
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Little_Devil on Sun Jan 05, 2014 9:40 pm

Strangely enough I had a few problems over the December / first week in January period. Some may relate to this, but anything is worth a try when investigating problems.

So first thing, I have noisy internal fans, and always get a fairly load noise when starting the machine, but oddly enough the CPU fan was not the problem. I said oddly because it was the CPU fan which actually had a problem. Computer was on then I heard a clattering noise. The side of the computer was off, so I could see the CPU fan, and it still looked OK, :lol: moments later there is a clatter, and the whole fan assembly fell off. Well that was not really a problem since at this time of year the ambient is lower, and the heat sink is a Zalman multiple heat pipe, with a 120mm case fan sat over the top of it, so it stays relatively cool.

Noise still there, but since there have been no problems with the machine, I don't consider it a problem. Stopped each internal fan in turn, and find it is graphics card fan, still not a problem as yet.

I did an update some time back, and noticed a problem so decided to investigate. The problem is related to IE so I had forgotten about it, but the problem does have other implications, as in some updates now will not install properly, and after a late December update, my machine decided to display the same problem as yours. It would be fine and merrily working, then for no apparent reason, shut down, and restart. Graphics card was warm but within acceptable levels and CPU cores were around 41 deg each, so again acceptable.
I ran malware bytes, which reported no problems, and my AV said everything was fine.

Started up my browser FF, and decided to check add ons. Strangely enough, the dictionary I always have on had disappeared, and 2 other programs had been installed, one of which I know as a sort of none invasive logger, it just looks at where you are shopping/what you are shopping for, and transmits these back to the market research company. Strange that nothing had picked them up, so I decided to remove anything at all which could possibly cause any problems.

I am just going through this in chronological order of things I did.

Next. I had noticed a small icon appear momentarily in the top left of my screen, after start up, so decided to investigate processes and services, to see if there was anything running which looked out of place. You can short cut this by just starting up msconfig.exe from the search in Win 7.
I did find a few unrecognised programs, and upon investigating found this
http://malwaretips.com/blogs/pup-option ... a-removal/

I stopped this particular one running LuaRT and another one called snoozer, and everything has been fins since.
No idea which of the above stopped the problem, but not really worried which, although it may help you.

As far as the IE problem and the updates is concerned, I found an MS article which basically said I had to reinstall windows.
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Little_Devil on Tue Jan 07, 2014 7:21 am

Something changed after all that, I ran Malware bytes again (www.malwarebytes.org) and this time I updated it :oops:
It found 15 PUP (potentially unfriendly programs) and a few bad registry entries, quarantined these, and then lo and behold, even the update that had refused to instal, and had been a major thorn in the side of many, worked.
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Silkie on Sat May 03, 2014 11:39 pm

One gigantic bit of procrastination later,,,,

I was right all along. I finally had it 'on the bench' running with the sides off and the fans aren't running. \one doesn't move while the other makes half hearted attempts to spin up even with software control set to 100%.

I'm going to try and lubricate them in case they have just seized up and failing that it's time to see if can either get a new fan set or alternate cooling. Worst case, new GPU time and the system runs on crappy Intel onboard for a while.

I hate it when I'm right and it's a bloody expensive graphics card bolloxed by two cheap sodding fans, thanks MSI.
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Flare on Sun May 04, 2014 8:46 am

One other thing that may cause the issue is power, if you havent got enough power from your PSU it will effect fans as well.
Sometimes keeping an eye on your stats is not a good thing :P

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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Silkie on Sun May 04, 2014 3:34 pm

It seems it's a not uncommon issue with the frozr 2 fans sadly. I have them dismantled but can't find anywhere open for decent oil. Failing this then I may have to decide to try new fans or new gpu.
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Little_Devil on Sun May 04, 2014 6:21 pm

Cheaper to put decent fans, that you can possibly transfer to a newer card if needed.

The thermal cut-out will kick in to protect the GPU, so the GPU should not have been harmed. A overheating GPU would invariably kick you out of any 3D program, shutting it down and switch to 2D.

I still don't understand why your computer would hard reset, since that would not be triggered unless it detects a bus fault, which an overheating GPU would not do, unless the design was so crap, that the card could affect the bus directly.
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Silkie on Tue May 13, 2014 4:41 pm

Wow my PC is a sick puppy. More testing reveals RAM errors as well as the GPU fans. :ill:
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Little_Devil on Tue May 13, 2014 5:45 pm

RAM errors are the most likely to cause a reset, particularly if there is a fault, since they are sat on the bus.

Most RAM controllers will fire off a high level interrupt if there is a critical error at any point, which will in turn force a reset.

A lot of errors of this nature are pretty variable, and can be something as simple as crap getting into the slots. Even unoccupied slots can cause a problem since the bus is common to all Memory, just the select pin/s is/are not addressed when a slot is empty. Up to a DRAM fault, memory controller chip error or indeed anything else which is connected to the control chip.
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Re: PC Resetting - possibly GPU

Postby Silkie on Tue May 13, 2014 8:06 pm

All the slots are populated and fortunately all still in warranty. I can pull one pair and still be fine as I went overboard on RAM anyway.
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